Trump is driving Catholic voters toward Clinton

Even weekly mass-goers favor Hillary
Republican presidential candidate Donald Trump speaks during a news conference at Trump National Doral, Wednesday, July 27, 2016, in Tampa, Fla. (AP Photo/Evan Vucci)

Republican presidential candidate Donald Trump speaks during a news conference at Trump National Doral, Wednesday, July 27, 2016, in Tampa, Fla. (AP Photo/Evan Vucci)

The following comes from a July 27 Five Thirty Eight article by Leah Libresco:

Donald Trump has held onto the support of evangelical Christians even as he has screwed up the name of a book of the Bible, but he’s doing terribly with Catholic voters, particularly those who are regular churchgoers.

Catholics who attend Mass weekly have increased their support for the Democratic nominee by 22 percentage points relative to 2012. They support Hillary Clinton at about the same rate as fallen-away Catholics; even though among white, non-Hispanic Catholics, those who attend Mass less frequently are slightly more likely to be registered Democrats.

In fact, Trump has done more to drive weekly churchgoers to the Democrats than Clinton has done to attract them. Evangelicals and Catholics who attend church regularly and favor the Democratic nominee consider Clinton a less appealing choice than Obama was.

The share of weekly churchgoing evangelicals who support the Democratic nominee has remained nearly flat from June 2012 to June 2016, but their reasons have changed. Two-thirds of churchgoing evangelical Obama supporters described their vote as “for Obama” rather than “against Romney” but the proportions are exactly flipped for Clinton.

libresco-trumpvoters-1

(from Five Thirty Eight article)

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  1. JD Cahill says:

    If you quizzed all those polled with a list of the many intrinsic evils that Clinton supports, would they still support Clinton as much?

    • FromThePew says:

      JDC, Here’s a HC statement:…..Hillary PROMOTES FREE Abortion! Says, “Let’s go make it happen”. Queen of the Deathocratic Party…..Read it @
      http://www.lifenews.com/2016/07/28/hillary-clinton-promotes-free-abortions-lets-go-out-there-and-make-it-happen/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+lifenews%2Fnewsfeed+%28LifeNews.com%29

      • FromThePew says:

        If spiritually confused Catholics vote like they did last time (over 50% sadly voted for BO & a DEATHocratic agenda) then soon we will be lamenting about: HC & her latest assault on our LIFE, our Liberty & our Religious Freedoms. Pray for deliverance for all world leaders held hostage (for whatever reasons) by demonic powers. Ask God to fight that battle for us thru our praise, prayers, sacrifices, fasting & continuing to be faithful. Beg the Queen of Heaven, Mother Mary, in our rosaries for deliverance from every evil & all demonic leadership in the name of Jesus. I do believe it’s not only a choice between Life & Death; it’s a matter of Life & Death……ours. PRAY!

    • I have taught Catholic high school for 40 years and I have found that Catholics are as ignorant about intrinsic evils etc., as you see with Jessie Waters on O’Reilly Factor. I have long ago ceased depending on Catholics, even many of those who go to mass weekly to know what candidates stand for and do. A perfect example of where many Catholics stand on intrinsic evils is to look at the two Vice Presidential candidates Kaine a “Catholic” who is given a 100%rating by NARAL and Planned Parenthood, and Pence a “former Catholic” now an evangelical who is give a 0% rating by NARAL and Planned Parenthood. I am closer to the former Catholic now evangelical than the man who receives communion each week. I have simply given up on so many of my…

      • la diabla blanca (Texas) says:

        “Catholics are as ignorant about intrinsic evils etc.”

        Amen.
        I have been a pro-life volunteer for over twenty-five years. We try to educate people but if they’re not interested in listening there’s not much we can do. I for example, for about twenty of those years, have been responsible for the weekly pro-life announcements in the parish bulletin. Luckily a former bishop (Grahmann in Dallas) began what is the Pro-Life Committee of North Texas and we have many diocesan events constantly going on (www,prolifedallas.org). That being said I have only maybe a couple square inches per week on average to get the word out (more during the summer when less is going on with other groups). I wish I could educate a parish about everything…

  2. Elizabeth M. says:

    How can any Catholic vote for Hillary with her stance on abortion?

    • Bob One says:

      Elizabeth, you are seeing Catholics go for Mrs. Clinton in spite of her stance on abortion. Her platform, for the most part, but not all, is much more toward Catholic teaching than her main opponent. Her primary rival has no clue what is involved in being a President in a democracy rather than a one-man-band. He advocates positions that are close to treason, exhibits no knowledge of our diplomatic alliances and of how laws are made. Even if he came out for the abolition of abortion in all circumstances, an educated rational person would have to choose someone else for whom to vote.

      • Bob, it’s great to speak your mind, but let’s all use our ‘right mind,’ as in correct, not right wing. Where/how has he advocated treason. Treason is letting our four heroes die like dogs in Libya, which were reachable, we could have save at least two. She worried about ‘our’ (her) brand rather than the lives. Your premises are seriously flawed, and you show yourself to be not pro-life, but an apolosgist for the most anti Catholic Democratic party and platform in history.

      • Ann Malley says:

        Actions speak louder than words, Bob One. Too often those who feel themselves educated and rational miss that one when they attempt to explain away the dirty hands and even dirtier dealings of the one they’ve been told is sophisticated when they break the laws they fully understand and lay waste the diplomatic alliances painstakingly built over decades.

        Translated, that means Clinton has the knowledge which makes her blatant misuse of said knowledge to the detriment of this country the chief reason why she should never be POTUS. That’s even outside the fact that she identifies as a Christian while stating that Churches must be made to change their opinion on abortion.

        If you think she’ll stop there, then you’re not that…

      • Hillary Clinton’s biggest donor is Planned Parenthood which not only dismembers little girls/boys in the womb but sells their body parts to the highest bidder. And some babies may be even born alive and so that they can retrieve better body parts. No one who claims to be Catholic can vote for a woman who would deny us our religious liberty, promote same-sex gender disorders and force Catholics to fund these abominations.

      • Anonymous says:

        Actually, Hilary knows abortion is wrong and she would like it to stop. She can only say that it is the woman’s choice as in not the government’s mandate. She could become a very pro-life president if she decides that abortion is an exploitation of the lower income women and 70% of women have abortions because they feel they have no choice. She might actually address the real issues on why so many women make such a horrible choice, even against their will.

      • Hosemonkey says:

        What makes you think that Obama was by any means qualified to be President? A man with very much to hide. A man who never held a real job in his life. A product of the Chicago Machine. Who financed his education? Who financed his campaign? And fools elected him twice. Slow learners, aren’t you. Hillary has spent her whole life weaving a similar skein of lies. Wake up! A new set of barbarians are at the gates.

    • Your Fellow Catholic says:

      Because Catholics are not required to pretend that abortion is the only issue.

      • “pretend”? Oh puleeeeesssseee!

      • Kristin says:

        Knowing one’s position on abortion – the “legal” killing of an unborn baby – tells you much about their views on a whole host of issues. If they can stomach murder in the womb, there’s really not much more I need to know about them.

      • Our bishops have led us to this place. Their lack of resolve, their softness on sin and Catechisis, their willingness to deal with the devil, their unwillingness to chastise errant politicians who proudly proclaim their Catholicity while supporting abominations, is an ongoing scandal and disgrace, yeilding a divorce rate, abortion rate that echoes the secular culture, an appalling lack of understanding of the Catholic faith, and a profanation of our liturgies. Trump has promised a Scalia, Clinton a Sotomayer, end of story. Quit echoing a press who’s lockstep aims with the leftist anti-God Dem. party are manifest and well documented re: Mr. Trump. He’s a lot brighter than almost anyone in the room, and some of you with your double digit…

      • Of course, life is the most important issue for without it all other issues are meaningless.

        • Gratias says:

          The Clintons have been in government for 30 years. They used speeches and a Clinton Family Foundation to enrich themselves through corrupt pay to play. Watch all about it for free at Breitbart by clicking on Clinton Cash. Donald Trump is the last great hope before this country slouches down to Marxism. Vote to Make America Great Again. We need a change of direction and Clinton is more lawlessness.

          • The Clinton Foundation–which was originally to be only to support the Clinton Library—as Gratias no doubt knows, also delivers less than 10% of its vast hundreds of millions, and possibly billions, of income to actual charitable outcomes (cf. Peter Schweizer’s devastating and fact-filled analysis, “Clinton Cash”; also independent financial analyst, Charles Ortel).

            Worst of all, HRC used her position as Secretary of State to guide millions of $$ in Haitian relief funds to lucrative contracts to her brother, Tony Rodham; to Digicel donor Denis O’Brien; and now-convicted fraud-man Claudio Osorio and Innovida, a firm which was to build housing for devastated Haitian residents. In the case of the last fakery, not a single house…

          • ..was built, but $40M in contributions to Haitian relief disappeared.

            Oh, yeah, US bishops, be “all in for Hillary”, your proportionalist underskirts are showing. Do it “for the children”.

          • Your Fellow Catholic says:

            Dear Gratias –

            It is not true that Clintons used Clinton Family Foundation to enrich themselves (https://www.clintonfoundation.org/about/frequently-asked-questions), and there is nothing wrong with a person taking speaking fees. It certainly isn’t Marxism. Many many people do it, Republican, Democrat, or Independent.

            Gracias

  3. FromThePew says:

    From the good people @ the Church Militant site–
    http://www.Catholics4Trump.com
    Analysis of pros & cons and how he is so much better than the alternative.
    It’s a no brainer if you want a ‘country’ VS another ‘UN state’.
    HC = more of the death culture coming to a place near you.
    Pray. May God deliver us and preserve our land, liberty & religious freedoms.

  4. The Democrat Party

    1. Shaking their fists at God – if looks could kill….
    2. Saying NO to God – We Will Not Serve.
    3. Wanting to be Godlike – In complete authority but denying anyone free will
    4. Silencing God – we see how far their agenda has taken us.
    _________________________________
    Thank God, HE will have the last Word!

  5. The Watchman says:

    Democrats want to deny people of faith freedom of religious expression on a number of the the major issues like abortion and the family. The democratic party is really the anti-democracy party. While Donald Trump is not by any means a perfect choice, how can people of deep faith continue to support the Democratic Party that is the party of the culture of death wanting to export the slaughter of the unborn to poor countries around the world. Once a country takes away freedom of religious expression that country is on the road to becoming a totalitarian tyranny. God pray for America and have mercy on America!

  6. Ann Malley says:

    An utter lack of Catholic catechesis and a perpetual marinating in Left Wing Social Justice Marxism is what is “driving” those who call themselves Catholics to consider Hillary Clinton for President.

    Talk about dumb sheep. Led right to slaughter by those who consider abortion sacred ground and doing one’s duty to one’s country as unChristian.

    Good job, USCCB. You’ve almost delivered. But once the sheep are all gone, I doubt your new master will reward you as promised. The Devil is still the Father of Lies, after all, despite what he tells you ;^)

    • Right on sister, this is Cultural Marxism at work. Catholicism is a rotting fish at this point, its starts from the head, Francis an apostate Pope and bleeds through the USCCB which is a clown college of progtards.

  7. From a bishop’s blog:(Abyssus Abyssum Invocat) “I do not see how any Christian person living out their faith could have been a Donald Trump supporter from the beginning. He lies at every turn, his actions are amoral and depraved, he shows no understanding of, or respect for, the founding of our nation and the beauty of our Constitution. He has shown no desire to live a virtuous life and therefore has no understanding that for any nation to stand strong it must stand for liberty and morality… that is so basic. His actions show him to be a dictator at heart as well as a narcissist-sociopath who will always and everywhere put ‘The Donald’ first – not America.” Fascinating.

  8. I came across another bishop’s blog along the same lines as that above from A.A.I. If, as above, the bishops damn Trump to hell, then Hillary will win in a landslide, receiving probably 75%-90% of the Catholic vote. The bishops will go with the devil they know (and have supported in the past) rather than the devil they don’t know, or so it seems to this inexperienced political commentator. I have begun to pray for President Hillary already.

    • hosemonkey says:

      Sounds like you have already thrown in the towel.

      • Horsemonkey, when two conservative prelates go on the warpath against Trump, think about the reaction by the “progressive” clergy, i.e., those who supported Obama. When Pope Francis refuses to call Islamic terrorism for what it is, you can be sure hoards of episcopal leaders will follow. Give me a good reason not to throw in the towel.

        • hosemonkey says:

          Why not throw in the towel?? Because if you surrender now or give up the fight, the field falls to the enemy. Evil triumphs. I would rather die on my feet than live on my knees. They may win, but they will surely know that they have been in a fight. The Church has been in the catacombs before, but she emerged, stronger than before. The True Church has been forced underground, but always emerged. Witness Japanese Catholics, persecuted for 300 years, no priests, but passing the True Faith on down through their children, preserving the Truth until 1852, when Adm. Perry’s Black ships brought the Japanese Christians back into the Light. Never surrender!

  9. St. Christopher says:

    No faithful Catholic can ever vote for Hillary Clinton, or for almost any Democratic candidate. Abortion, elimination of sin for sexual perversions and fornication, all of these things serve to forbid anyone voting — anyone — for Hillary Clinton.

    No “Catholic option” on this exists, although we are sure to see the dopey USCCB come out with a Zombie-Liberal leaning document that would serve to “justify” a Catholic from voting for this impossibly evil person, Hillary Clinton.

  10. Anonymous says:

    “Donald Trump has held onto the support of evangelical Christians even as he has screwed up the name of a book of the Bible..”

    So Leah Lebresco introduces another contrived narrative from the five thirty-eight website (a site which is the child of uber-liberal and pro Clinton/Obama supporter Nate Silver, all pro-abortionists, one may note).

    Trump while at Liberty University for a rally earlier this year cited 2nd Corinthians as “Two Corinthians”. I cant tell you how many USF Jesuit theology profs referred to the 2nd book of a NT or OT biblical book in the same way, and these were the old experts like the late Fr. John Huesman, SJ, Fr. Timothy Leahy, SJ, and Fr. Gerald Collins, SJ (this was in the day when you had to…

    • hosemonkey says:

      Could it be that Catholics who are bailing out of the Church are doing so for a reason? Could it be that this post-Vatican Church has become too PC to stomach? Could it be that the bulwark of western civilization is no longer a safe haven against the Evil One? One wonders.

      • Yes, this is the sad song of sedevacantists and/or sympathizers of your beloved SSPX. Repent people. Repent.

        • Ann Malley says:

          You mean your beloved scapegoat, jon. The SSPX is a vehicle by which the truth is conveyed, not the inventor of it as those who now purport that truth can suddenly change are doing. You should repent of trying to change God’s words and truth in order to appease the masses and gain access to their pocket books and votes.

          Whatever your issue, your animosity with the SSPX and having to tag that as the demon of everything is rather telling. The truth must scare you quite a bit more than you’re willing to own.

          • Ann Malley listen to yourself. A vehicle of truth CANNOT be that which is disobedient, ok? There is no truth in being disobedient, unfaithful to, headstrong against, derisive of, the anointed shepherds of the Church as imperfect and weak as they are. God chooses the weak to make a mockery of the “wise”. This is how God does things. So go ahead Ann Malley, carry on with your disobedience fest.

        • Sad jon the pious hates facts and must stigmatize those who note the truth, in this case, the exodus from the Catholic Church: The Pew Survey people must be sedesvacantists:

          https://cruxnow.com/church/2015/05/12/pew-survey-percentage-of-us-catholics-drops-and-catholicism-is-losing-members-faster-than-any-denomination/

          So, the Pew Survey (May 2015) cites that at least 3 million Catholics have left the Church since 2007, even accounting for increases from immigration. (The US Bishops numbers acknowledge 4 million have left the US Catholic Church.) Excepting Africa and small Catholic populations in Asia, the story is the same world-wide.

          • Poor Campion, committing an error in logic and reasoning. Correlation, Campion, does not necessarily mean causation. Pew will give you the numbers (and I had seen these Pew numbers), but they can’t tell you what causes them. So, Campion, try again.

          • Your Fellow Catholic says:

            And the exodus has nothing to do with the exposure of the priest sex abuse scandal?

          • Today, we are told that we cannot judge Vatican 2 by its results: “propter hoc ergo hoc”. We are told it is fallacy to evaluate a cause based on its subsequent outcome (no matter how illogical that logic is): “correlation is not causation”.

            This now oft-repeated mantra of the progressive New Church is becoming more insistent, because all the “economic indicators” show undeniably that V2 and its implementation, by every measure, has been a near-mortal blow to the Catholic Church. However, this reasoning — “correlation is not causation, you cant blame V2, it would have happened anyway”—- also is anti-Scriptural: Jesus warns pointedly against false prophets and their devices: “By their fruits you shall know them.” (Mt. 7:16)…

          • If we were to believe you, how come notable prelates of the Church, whom you yourself might admire are not saying the same thing?? FOR EXAMPLE, Burke, Schneider, Mueller, Sarah, Cordileone, and the other solid prelates of the Church ALL SUPPORT ALL OF THE DOCUMENTS, ALL OF THE TEACHINGS of the Council!

            Yes Campion I will put you to task on this one because you have to be CLEAR in your head what is causing the situation you describe. To blame it on a set of documents (Vatican II’s) is FAULTY!

  11. Warren Goddard says:

    Our Bishops should announce that it is a sin to vote for Clinton
    or close shop.

    • Your Fellow Catholic says:

      They can’t because it’s not true, and even if it were true, they wouldn’t risk their tax exempt status to say so.

      • hosemonkey says:

        No guts, there’s your answer. If you take the King’s shilling, you must step to the King’s drum, full stop. I am sure that saints and martyrs did not fret about tax exemptions and bad press.

    • FromThePew says:

      WG, Yes. Cardinals, Bishops, Priests should shout this from the pulpit. Sadly, most of them will not. The USCCB takes BILLIONS in government funds for African AIDS care & other charity work. They are COMPROMISED = AFRAID to speak the truth & stop the ‘gravy’ train. Truth: Grave sin for CATHOLICS to vote pro-abortion because it is the pinnacle of intrinsic evils. Are you confused by the lesser ‘death penalty’ narrative? Confused Catholics wrongly conclude that “Catholics are not required to think about abortion as the only issue” which is a evil statement. Pity poor souls that will be asked some day to make an accounting for their unholy voting choice. Will they try to argue that millions of aborted babies were a lesser…

      • FromThePew says:

        Continued……..(cut off) Will those voting for the pro-abortion platform, party, candidates like HC & her ilk, try to argue with God? That God’s gift of millions of babies, discarded & killed by abortion, were a LESSER EVIL than (insert any other issue), so I voted against God’s awesome gift of life? Abortion is THE key issue. Beware of anyone who tells you different. They are in serious need of spiritual help. Evil can be very persuasive, so they have your company in hell! The ultimate PONZIE game for your soul. The bottom line is: pro-life or pro-death? Anything else is unholy confusion.

        • hosemonkey says:

          Well said. There is no comparison between an innocent child in the womb an a criminal who has been convicted of a heinous crime.

          • No comparison between an innocent child in the womb and a convicted criminal?? Really?? Hosemonkey, that statement shows how you have lost some marbles up there. BOTH ARE HUMAN BEINGS for whom the Son of God gave His life! Perhaps what you mean to say is that taking the life of the innocent is of a graver sin than executing the guilty. If so, then I would have let your comment pass. But what you said up there is foolish, un-Biblical, inhuman, and WRONG!

          • Your Fellow Catholic says:

            In fact, I think the only promise of salvation to a living individual in all of the Gospels was addressed to a convicted criminal: “Truly I tell you, today you will be with me in paradise.”

            housemonkey also forgets that many innocent people have been convicted and put to death or nearly so, and the fact that this happens blows his argument out of the water.

      • Your Fellow Catholic says:

        You are completely contradicting Vatican guidance on the matter, going back decades.

        • hosemonkey says:

          Then Vatican guidance is faulty. There, I said it. Vatican guidance has been faulty in many areas since Vatican II, witness the antics of our present Pope. Democrats and their catamites are at war with God and the Church is standing idly by.

          • You should really read Canon Law, hosemonkey. Specifically read Canon 1373 which prohibits inciting animosity against the Holy See and bishops, which includes the Pope. It’s sinful. I hear that the devil is very legalistic. Therefore, if you were to read that Canon and reflect upon it, it may diffuse your negativity which the evil spirits use to the detriment of your salvation.

            Or if you wish, I’ll print that Canon here: “A person who publicly incites among subjects animosities or hatred against the Apostolic See or an ordinary because of some act of power or ecclesiastical ministry or provokes subjects to disobey them is to be punished by an interdict or other just penalties.”

            I hope that helps your spiritual health.

          • Your Fellow Catholic says:

            Has nothing to do with Vatican II. The usual anti-Catholic, anti-Vatican II canard.

          • Ann Malley says:

            The cover it over with icing canard. Vatican II was a pastoral council ripe with compromise that has caused division.

            What is anti-Catholic is pretending that ambiguous pastoral language is binding when it is not. Catholics are bound to adhere to the truth, not obfuscation.

            The stirring of public animosity is something to be laid at the feet of prelates and their toadies that are the source of scandal. Don’t advertise yourself as Catholic or a follower of truth if you’re going to deviate and play kaleidoscope eyes.

          • Catherine says:

            jon, Who is AKA, Mr. No Death Penalty, has NEVER once asked anyone to read or uphold Canon 915.

            “I hear the devil is very “legalistic” = And selectively duplicitous too.

          • Campion says:

            jon the pious trots out his anathemas and excommunications again. Even as the official Catholic Church collapses.

            Hitler’s SS were hanging people, too, as “deserters” and Russian collaborators, right up to the day he committed suicide (Apr. 30th, 2015).

            Desperate times call for desperate people, desperate measures.

          • What Hitler and the Russians have anything our to do with your disobedience is a stretch Campion. As usual yours is the usual straw-man argument, with historics and histrionics.

  12. No sincere and knowledgeable Catholic could vote for a Demoncrat in good conscience.

    Any Catholic who would support a Demoncrat candidate is a phony Catholic.

  13. I attend Mass not only on Sunday’s but daily as well. I am a college educated person with a BA in sociology from a Catholic college in California, and then later with an STB, STL, and JCL from the Pontifical University of St. Thomas Aquinas in Rome, Italy. I would have liked to have someone else as the Republican candidate, but that is not the case. I cannot possibly vote for Hillary Clinton with her Pro-Choice agenda. I have no other option in good conscience than to vote for Donald Trump and pray that if elected he follows through with Pro-Life appointments to the supreme court. May God and His Mother help the USA!!!

    • Dave N. says:

      The idea that Donald Trump will take a principled stand on abortion (or any other moral issue for that matter) is laughable. He lives in an openly adulterous relationship.
      Also, it’s probably not a good idea to be bragging about your various degrees on one hand, while demonstrating to the world you’re having trouble forming plurals in English on the other.
      There’s a reason that Trump appeals to the uneducated as well as the ill-educated.

    • FromThePew says:

      MJG, It boils down to a pro-life candidate (Trump) or pro-death (HC). Nothing is perfect in this world but some choices are crystal clear. Vote for life. Without life, everything else is MOTE. The good people @ Church Militant have gathered information on the issues for times like these. Go to this site, click here, @
      http://www.Catholics$Trump.com to see pros & cons by traditional catholics. If your progressive, then I can’t help you…only God can.

  14. Bob One says:

    The Catholic Bishops are very clear in their teachings about our role in the electoral process: http://www.usccb.org/issues-and-action/faithful-citizenship/upload/forming-consciences-for-faithful-citizenship.pdf. Perhaps we should all read it, in its entirety before we post our own opinions, many incorrect. This is one election where the common good may over ride even support for a candidate who believes other than we do about evil. Among the highest forms of evil, we always have abortion. Also on that list is torture, racism, death penalty, etc. We need to know what we are talking about.

    • Steve Phoenix says:

      Utilitarian ethics on display, Bob One.

    • I do know what I’m talking about, and what I’m saying is that the Democrat Party is the party of destruction and evil because of its leftist ideology.

      Any so-called Catholic who believes that the Democrat Party is preferable to the only other realistic option is delusional.

      If Democrats continue to solidify power in the federal and state governments, you will see legislative and executive efforts to make practicing Christianity de facto illegal, as is happening in California at an alarming rate.

      Democrats are leftist totalitarians who are enemies of religious freedom, among other things. Natural, God-given rights will be curtailed in America if Hillary is President and selects up to five justices to sit on the Supreme Court…

    • Campion says:

      Bob One, here is your party, the DNC, giving 3 cheers for the abortion: Ilyse Hogue of NARAL getting a mammoth cheer for abortion from the attendees this past week:

      http://email.vervemail.com/hostedemail/email.htm?CID=27368419894&ch=1C6DCCB6EADAF2111D2AF9B031EC2660&h=424f96b6866a166c4442bbed7e02361e&ei=6v76PZ1Nw&schema=echo7

      Enjoy, cheerleader Bob!

    • FromThePew says:

      B1, It’s simple, choose life or death. And yes I know what the USCCB says. BUT the reason LIFE is the pinnacle of all intrinsic evils, the top of the heap, is because without life everything else (any other awful evil) is mote. Then looking @ pure numbers, NOTHING says unholy deaths, maiming & killing like ABORTION does it? Or perhaps you think HC’s ‘FREE ABORTION’ speech @ the DNC are worthy of your vote? Good luck explaining that ‘logic’ when you are called to your eternal judgement of your immortal soul.

  15. just sayin' says:

    Any Catholics who would vote for Hillary Rodham Clinton would be voting to kill even more babies here and around the world. But that’s not all; Catholic Hillary voters would also be voting for government persecution of their own Church. Recall that as Hillary touted abortion at the Women in the World Conference in NYC in April 2015, she said, “deep-seated…religious beliefs have to be changed” in order for abortion to be enshrined everywhere. The U.S. bishops are sealing the Church’s fate if they don’t tell Catholics they can’t vote for Hillary.

  16. As I had mentioned in the other article on Tim Kaine, people, there is taste of hypocrisy in your comments. Here’s why: So you castigate Catholics who are going to vote Democrat. You marvel at how these Catholics could vote for a party that has abortion in its platform, and indeed that is grossly wrong for how can a faithful Catholic vote in such a manner. One point for you people there.

    However, your are not guiltless yourselves for you likewise dissent from clear teachings of the Church. Your dissent may not be intrinsic evils, such as your support of the death penalty, non-support of social issues of the Church, your castigation of the Holy See, disrespect for the Holy Father, bishops and priest, publicly and scandalously,…

    • your denigration of the Ordinary Form—but nonetheless these are sins for which you will have to answer for.

      Now, I say this not as a Democrat nor a Republican, but people, the way a Catholic votes is their business, for which they will give an account. Be reminded that the Republican Party IS NOT the Catholic Church in prayer. Indeed that party may be better than the alternative, but among those of you who dissent on a seemingly minor issue of the faith you are are not suitable to judge your fellow Catholics on this matter. It makes you sound hypocritical.

      • There you go again – light the message board on fire and bring up the NO. Before we get started, let’s get one fact on the table. The principle author of the NO was one Archbishop Annibale Bugnini, later exposed as a Freemason who was exiled to Iran (maybe Turkey) by Pope Paul VI. Source of this information is eminent historian Michael Davies.

        • Catherine says:

          Ralph, Men, can see, that Pope Benedict XVI was forced to flee, for fear of the wolves, yet, they cannot bring themselves, to believe, that there were conspiring wolves, working back then, to bring about the gradual destruction and loss of faith. Bishop Athanasius Schneider, courageously spoke up about clarifying many things that have been hijacked in the “spirit of Vatican II.” Men would rather ignore the truth because clarifying what actually took place at Vatican II is like asking fearful men to expose and then clarify the real damage done by the contents of Vatileaks. “It is better that scandals arise then for the TRUTH to be suppressed.”- Pope Gregory

      • Ann Malley says:

        jon, you denigrate the truth by ignoring the elephant in the room. Or attempting to call the elephant a flamingo because, thanks to pastoral speak, there have been allowances made for those who are inured to label everything a flamingo. Including furniture and small children.

        Sorry, pal, but by their fruits you shall know them.

        The NO is demonstrably not what it should be. And the method of being liberal to a fault with regard to allowing “Social Justice” to usurp Catholic doctrine is similarly faulty. As demonstrated by “Catholic” Tim Kaine.

        • Catherine says:

          “And the method of being liberal to a fault with regard to allowing “Social Justice” to usurp Catholic doctrine is similarly faulty. As demonstrated by “Catholic” Tim Kaine ”

          Excellent, Ann Malley!

          • The point is that the vociferous disobedient lot who lurk here and castigate the Magisterium are just as much disobedient as these Catholic Democrats, maybe to a lesser extent, but disobedient nonetheless.

          • Ann Malley says:

            The point, jon, is obedience in all but sin is required. That is why a “magisterium” that doubles back to eat its own head is not a true magisterium.

            Authority is for the sake of upholding the body, not browbeating it into self destruction. But that Catch-22 is what you are hoping will net you the best haul of dumb sheep. Sorry. But the sheep are biting now out of pure starvation. Get used to it. You created it.

            Thanks, Catherine.

        • First of all Ann Malley, I am jon, not “pal.” Secondly, people like you should be eternally grateful for the Ordinary Form, because it taught you and many other Catholics after the Second Vatican Council what is going on at the Mass, Ok? Prior to the Council many Catholics had NO CLUE what was going on up there while they’re praying the rosary. If it weren’t for the Second Vatican Council which gave way for for the Mass of Paul VI, you wouldn’t what truly a gift the Eucharist is.

          You mention the elephant in the room. The elephant in the room is your disobedience.

          • hosemonkey says:

            Jon The Pious,
            , Are you totally clueless? Have you been totally lulled by
            the weak beer of VII? Are you satisfied with the NO mass? Have you ever assisted at a mass in Latin? My guess is that you are too young to have known the Church before it was gelded. Too bad. The Church has a holy obligation to teach the Truth and when the truth is not taught or is distorted, the faithful have the right and obligation to protest. That does NOT make us Protestants, merely informed as to the Truth. BTW, my spiritual health is just fine, thank you it is assisted by Catholic Truth, not by wishy-washy heresies.

          • Ann Malley says:

            Pal, (Yes, Jon, that’s you;^) the Novus Ordo may have been marketed as a method to teach Catholic Faith, but that is tantamount to using Barney the Dinosaur as a method to teach college students. Out of place. People do and should GROW UP.

            The elephant in the room is your obtuseness and playing the useful tool of destruction.

        • Hosemonkey says:

          I strongly believe that Jon is too young to remember the Catholic Church before it was gelded and horribly damaged by VII and the Vandals that seized it. He says that the faithful had no clue as to what was taking place in the mass. He has never heard of a book called a “missal”, Latin on one side, vernacular on the other. I traveled the world and with missal in hand, I knew exactly what was going on, no matter which country that I was in. Isn’t that amazing, Jon? You just can’t do that with the NO, Jon. Jon, you really need to inform yourself on how you are being shortchanged.

          • Justin K. says:

            ..Actually, hosemonkey, I think the “beer of V2” that pious jon, humble and true-blue, he has been imbibing, may be a powerful 9% Czech-style brew—that certainly will explain his ranting and raving at the SSPX windmills..and other pink elephants in the room..

      • Campion says:

        The left-wing mask falls off jon the pious. Time for Hillary.

        • Go ahead and quote what you find as “left-wing” in my comment. Go ahead. Prove it.

          • Ann Malley says:

            …you prove it with your comments, jon. You may be so thoroughly indoctrinated to not see it, but when you intimate that me and others were so utterly clueless prior to VII and the Novus Ordo to understand what was going on up there is to pretend that VII and the NO are more than what they are.

            You seem to be creating an idol for yourself. An idol that would pretend that truth and goodness only existed thanks to an unbinding ambiguity.

            That is proof of the kind of hogwash that passes for “education” these days. Where students are taught specifically not to think, but merely to be obedient for obedience sake.

          • See people, I got you and caught you all in your hypocrisy. Look at your feeble responses. For your information, I do attend the TLM, as well as the Ordinary Form, and I love both of them. Both are VALID in the eyes of the Church, and guess what—SAINTS are also being formed among those who go to the Mass of Paul VI. That priest-martyr in France, a victim of ISIS, is perhaps the latest one. So that pulls the rug from underneath many of your arguments. For you folks to think that God’s grace is somehow imperiled because of the “Novus Ordo” manner of celebration is bunk. This is why I am beginning to think that Pope Francis is most likely the perfect Pontiff for you disobedient folks.

            PLUS, it is the present Magisterium, not…

          • you, not the SSPX, that is the authentic teachers of the faith. They may not be perfect men, but neither are you, nor are your beloved SSPX. Yet God has chosen them nonetheless as imperfect as they are to guard the deposit of faith and guide the Church.

            So yeah, carry on with your disobedience-fest.

          • Justin K. says:

            Many words, so little truth. .

          • Ann Malley says:

            Sorry, jon, but the disobedience fest is being demonstrated by those with collars who are somehow under the misconception that they have replaced Christ.

            You can distract all you’d like, using whatever acronym you’d like. But organizations rise and fall without the Truth. If there is a rise in the organization that threatens you so – or your idea that truth is something manufactured – well, that’s your problem, jon.

            Our Lord chose Balaam’s ass to speak truth when His will was being circumvented, so have at it. Call the Society whatever you’d like. That’s immaterial. In fact, the poorer the vessel used to chastise those in authority, the more certain we can be that it is God’s will in action.

            As for the killing in Rouen,…

          • Ann Malley says:

            …it is juvenile to correlate Fr. Hamel’s sacrifice to the rite of mass. Sorry. People can live off of Happy Meals, too. But that is not the best means of feeding oneself.

            Again, perhaps you should reflect on truth and not your version of truth, jon. For you are feeding on stereotypes and gross misstatements. That is not of God.

  17. Catherine says:
  18. Michael McDermott says:

    MEET THE GOP BILLIONAIRE BEHIND LGBT PUSH
    Mat Staver exposes effort to enlist youth in ‘army to change America’
    http://www.wnd.com/2016/07/meet-the-gop-billionaire-behind-lgbt-push/#27FybZa2ZGZ9sa8x.99
    Paul Singer has been targeting Republican candidates, lawmakers and the Republican Party platform. Now, he is reaching out to Christian students on college campuses.
    Singer has an elaborate funding and organizational scheme that appears to support Christians and gain their goodwill while at the same time working against them to advance his same-sex marriage and LGBT agenda

    Billionaire New York hedge-fund manager Paul Singer and Tim Gill are behind Freedom for All Americans, which produced the false propaganda. Singer and Gill, the…

  19. Michael McDermott says:

    NOT WHAT IT LOOKS LIKE
    The GOP is no longer what it looks like, and America is no longer the country it used to be.
    http://www.churchmilitant.com/video/episode/vortex-not-what-it-looks-like?

    As faithful Catholics — as opposed to just cultural or lapsed Catholics — watch in horror as Hillary Clinton moves one step closer to her life ambition of being president, a natural tendency arises to become a default Republican supporter.

    Hillary Clinton’s worldview is evil. The woman is possessed by an evil view of the world. She is a danger to everyone she is around because of her insidiousness and deceit. Under no circumstances can she ever be supported by anyone Catholic. So let’s just get that out of the way right up front. She is a…

    • Michael McDermott says:

      NOT WHAT IT LOOKS LIKE
      The GOP is no longer what it looks like, and America is no longer the country it used to be.
      http://www.churchmilitant.com/video/episode/vortex-not-what-it-looks-like?

      As faithful Catholics — as opposed to just cultural or lapsed Catholics — watch in horror as Hillary Clinton moves one step closer to her life ambition of being president, a natural tendency arises to become a default Republican supporter.

      Hillary Clinton’s worldview is evil.
      Under no circumstances can she ever be supported by anyone Catholic. So let’s just get that out of the way right up front. She is a living, walking, talking embodiment of an enemy of Christ.

      That said, the default to support the Republican Party, candidate and…

  20. Michael McDermott says:

    Senator Santorum knows Donald Trump will fight for Middle America https://youtu.be/bpjxM7TFXJY

    • Michael, I forget the author’s name, but he recently wrote a book called Elegy of a Hillbilly. An interview of him about the book was recently posted on Abyssum Abyssum Invocat. The author is one of the few people from Appalachia that has had a chance for a decent education. He tells in the interview why the poor working class, including miners who have lost their jobs, are voting for Donald Trump.

      The author was in the Marines and fought in the recent wars. He reminds us that it is the poorer people who fight most of our wars, then come back here with missing limbs and horrible wounds to nothing — no good veteran care, no jobs, no chance for a decent education, just poverty — while many immigrants coming into this country get most…

  21. Clinton R. says:

    It is not surprising “Catholics” are supporting Hillary Clinton. They were pro-Obama too. In the post Vatican II era, the faithful have become comfortable with sinfullness. In fact to the point, where the word has become verboten. Attitudes among those who call themselves Catholic have been warped by heterodox bishops, priests, nuns and everyone else who dissents against Church teaching and sanity. Same sex “marriage”? “Hey what’s wrong with it?” Sodomy? “who am I to judge?” Contraception? ” I don’t want a bunch of kids” Abortion? “I do want to force my beliefs on others.” Many of the bishops want to keep their seats of honor at banquets and will not rock the boat.

    • Clinton R. says:

      The only topic they will speak out about now is the environment, immigration and the death penalty. The same topics favored by Democrats, and unfortunately Pope Francis. The famous supporters of Hillary Clinton are the Hollywood elite who fill our youth with their profanity and godlessness. And did I mention George Soros has given $25 million to elect Hillary? The same George Soros who funds anti-Catholic NGO’s such as Catholics in Alliance for the Common Good. Just follow the money trail and the bodies buried. Hillary Clinton can not be voted by a Catholic in good conscience.

  22. John Feeney says:

    There are people advocating abortion on this Catholic website!

  23. FromThePew says:

    If you are NOT into: 1 world order, open borders, UN military, etc. read:
    ECONOMIST MAG: GLOBALISTS MUST RALLY BEHIND HILLARY
    “The future of the LIBERAL world order depends on whether she succeeds.”
    The Economist – JULY 29, 2016 Found @
    http://www.infowars.com/economist-mag-globalist-must-rally-behind-hillary

  24. This article is unadulterated camel dung.
    Genuine Catholics could no more vote for the Dems that they could Satan. The Dems have elevated partial birth abortion to sacramental statues. If the information contained within this article is even true…doubtful, i am a journo and i absolutely know where the establishment Cath press comes from, it cant possibly represent a trend.

    Go Trump, take America back from the phony Catholics, abortionists and Islamic terror apologists.

  25. Bob One says:

    We need to know that for which we vote. Read the party platforms for each major party, even though they are just a piece of paper for most candidates and don’t really provide direction. But they are still worth reading. Here is the link to the GOP: https://prod-static-ngop-pbl.s3.amazonaws.com/media/documents/DRAFT_12_FINAL%5B1%5D-ben_1468872234.pdf, Here is the link to the Democratic platform: https://www.demconvention.com/platform/. One encourages growing and improving the country, the other tearing down fifty years of improvement. Each can make own decision on which is which.

  26. Oh….note to editor, thank you for allowing this free form comment section and not censoring it. Most all the time the comments are very literate and seem to be reflective of a growing, hopefully, traditional Catholic movement. It might get to the point where i can venture back into church, something i genuinely miss. If not, no problemo, the Big Guy is after all, everywhere.

    William

  27. How could any Catholic vote for the corrupt Clintons is hard to understand for me. You will get with Democrats is more Cultural Marxism, and California is showing the path. Our enemies got homosexual marriage, then moved straight into Euthanasia which is the law since June 8, 2016. Now they are about to pass a law that Christian colleges must sign onto health plans with abortion and contraception before their students can apply for student loans in California that are dispensed by the all-reaching Government. Many Christian colleges will have to close down. Next they will start with Eugenics or post-partum Euthanasia. Enjoy your crooked Faith brothers!

  28. Hillary Clinton, at a Planned Parenthood event in April, 2015, stating that people must change their religious beliefs to accommodate abortion:

    ‘“Far too many women are denied access to reproductive health care and safe childbirth, and laws don’t count for much if they’re not enforced,” she said Thursday, per the Daily Caller. “And deep-seated cultural codes, religious beliefs and structural biases have to be changed.”

    Read more at: http://www.nationalreview.com/article/417448/

  29. A link in the following article by the Independent Sentinel provides the actual tape and video where Big Mother tells us her strident plan to impose abortion and force change of religious beliefs:

    http://www.independentsentinel.com/hillary-says-americans-will-have-to-change-their-personal-and-religious-beliefs/

    Quite impressive.

  30. FromThePew says:

    Continued from above……….what’s next on…… the ‘population control’ agenda of the DEATHocratic party? NEWS: HC promotes FREE ABORTION! A promise she made in her acceptance speech at the DNC this week. Abortion is unholy enough, but to push for FREE ABORTION is demonic. Dear God of all the universe, when will we be delivered from this insanity? ANYBODY that votes for HC has blood on their hands & NO SOUL! And will not be able to explain themselves on judgement day; that this ‘choice’ seemed to be a lesser EVIL.

  31. “driving Catholic voters toward . . .”

    Thus the biblical term “Sheep.”

  32. Catherine says:

    LES FEMMES – THE TRUTH: Open Letter to Donald Trump from David Martin

    http://lesfemmes-thetruth.blogspot.com/2016/07/open-letter-to-donald-trump-from-david.html

  33. Catholics? What catholics? They are all protestant since they don’t know or follow much of true Roman Catholic teaching. Anyone voting for Mrs. Clinton hasn’t a clue of the devils influences upon them. Pray for them. Hillary is an unconvicted but just the same a criminal for breaking US Presidential Security Code. Hillary has supported and in that regards been an accomplice to the murder of perhaps millions of innocent children via abortions. She failed at running the State Department in the middle east and far east. She was fired for her deceiving a federal investigation years before she was a White House resident. So why would you ever promote her? Her acking bpredecessor has no competence, no experience, and no common sense…

    • You know, as James says, Hilliary’s “administration” of State especially must be noted for the “Miracle of Ben-Ghazi”—yes, because were it not for Tyrone Woods and Glen Daugherty (the latter a Catholic, by the way; Ty Woods was the father of 3), the two ex-SEAL contractors who died, over 30 Americans might have been captured, tortured and murdered.

      Hillary was likely notifed within 15 min. of the attack (about 4pm Washington time), but did nothing for 6 hours—until calling a political strategy meeting about 10pm to falsely blame a video for the attack. Kris Paranto, one of the surviving ex-SEAL’s, called—for hours— for aerial support—and was countermanded by Hillary Clinton:
      http://www.frontpagemag

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