Praying for a full church

From the pastor’s laptop
A photo from the Pontifical Mass celebrated by His Grace, The Most Reverend Salvatore Cordileone, Archbishop of San Francisco, on the Solemnity of the Exaltation of the Holy Cross and 7th Anniversary of the implementation of Pope Benedict XVI’s Motu Proprio “Summorum Pontificum” at Star of the Sea

Pontifical Mass celebrated at Star of the Sea by Archbishop Salvatore Cordileone of San Francisco, on the Solemnity of the Exaltation of the Holy Cross and 7th Anniversary of the implementation of Pope Benedict XVI’s Motu Proprio “Summorum Pontificum” 

The following comes from a Nov. 19 posting on the blog of Father Joseph Illo, pastor of Star of the Sea parish in San Francisco.

Last Sunday in this space I was moaning over our mostly-empty Masses. But I guess I could see the church as three-quarters empty, or I could see it as one-quarter full! The other day I was again praying in the church with Father  Driscoll and Brother Ivan. Our ever-faithful Thelma Queri was quietly preparing altar flowers in the sacristy.

I was struck by the goodness and beauty in our parish, even when membership is at an historical low. I began to think of all the good folk at Star—those who set up for Mass, those who run our thriving school, those who pray in the church every day, those who sing in our choirs. By God’s grace, our parish will flourish again!

I write from Fatima, Portugal, where I am giving some talks at a clergy retreat. 45 priests from 15 countries have gathered to reconsecrate themselves to Jesus Christ through Our Lady.

I was at dinner with two priests, one from Germany and one from Malawi. The African has thousands at his Masses, but only a small building; the German has a magnificent baroque church, but only about 110 people on Sundays. The German said, “Attendance is poor, but their faith is rich.” The Malawian said, “The building is poor, but the faith is rich.” Both were joyful priests.

Yesterday I flew through Paris on my way to Lisbon. I was delighted that everyone addressed me, with a smile, as mon pere (“my father”). As secular as France has become, she still has at least some faith in the priesthood. The faith is not yet dead in Paris, Berlin, or San Francisco! By God’s grace, and our hard work, it will flourish again.

To read the original posting, click here.

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  1. This thanksgiving evening we have so much to give thanks for. Fathers like Joseph Illo are the gift of God at the cost of enormous personal sacrifices to Fr. Illo. This new Oratorium in a magnificent urban parish run by Diocesan priests is the model to follow for the our remnant that wishes to keep the ancient faith. If the glass is one quarter full now it will be half-full in a jiffy. Illo cuts a handsome Athletic figure, is highly edúcated, and charitable as can be. I was happy to contribute my tax-free donation to his new Philip Neri Oratory now that they have their separate bank account. Star of the Sea will be the rising star of the reform of the reform, which seems difficult to prohibit here in the land of the Free.

    Happy Thanksgiving, everyone.

  2. God bless all of our Faithful Priests.

    Much of today’s lack of the faithful is because Diocese Bishops and their Priests have not taught the faith fully and accurately over the last 50 years.
    1 1/2 generations have been lost due to lack of TRUTH.

    Everyone must encourage all literate persons to read Sacred Scripture (Catholic Bible) and the “Catechism of the Catholic Church” (1997).
    For quotes from our Popes –
    “What Catholics REALLY Believe SOURCE”
    http://whatcatholicsreallybelieve.com/

    ” My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge;
    because you have rejected knowledge,
    I reject you from being a priest to me.
    And since you have forgotten the law of your God,
    I also will forget your children. ” – Hosea 4:6

  3. In his book “Light of the World” 2010 by Pope Benedict XVI, the following is on a page all by itself:
    “God looks dowm from heaven upon the sons of men,
    to see if there are any that are wise, that seek after God . . . .
    They eat God’s bread,
    But they do not call upon his name.” Psalm 53:2-4

  4. In his book “FAITH and the FUTURE” (1970) Cardinal Ratzinger (Pope Benedict XVI) starting on page 115 –
    ” We have no need of a Church that celebrates the cult of action in political prayers. It is utterly superfluous. Therefore it will destroy itself. What will remain is the Church of Jesus Christ,….
    The kind of priest who is no more than a social worker can be replaced by the psychotherapist and other specialists……
    The Church of tomorrow will emerge – a Church that has lost much. She will become small and will have to start afresh more or less from the beginning. She will no longer be able to inhabit many of the edifices she built in prosperity. As the number of her adherents diminishes, so will she lose many of her social privileges. ……
    The Church will be a more spiritual Church, not presuming on a political mandate, flirting as little with the Left as with the Right. …..”

  5. For those who live in or are visiting the San Fran area,
    The EF Mass (Latin) is celebrated at the following locations.

    Immaculate Conception Chapel
    3255 Folsom St., San Francisco 94110 (415) 824-1762
    Sunday: 5 pm

    Most Holy Redeemer Church
    100 Diamond Street
    San Francisco, California 94114
    (415) 863-6259
    Monday-Friday 9:30 a.m. (Call to confirm)

    Star of the Sea Church
    4420 Geary Blvd., San Francisco 94109 (415) 751-0450
    Weekday and Holy Day: 7:30 am (Latin Low Mass)
    Sunday: 11 am (Latin High Mass)
    1st Friday: 6:30 pm (Latin High Mass)

    Always check the San Francisco Diocese web site for updates.
    http://www.sfarchdiocese.org/home/parishes/extraordinary-form

    • For those who have never attended an Extraordinary Form of the Mass, (Latin) here is some information I hope you will find helpful.

      Some differences:
      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VbwrH53-4oU

      Latin-English Booklet Missal (not expensive)
      http://www.fraternitypublications.com/labomi.html

      St. Edmund Campion Missal & Hymnal (moderately priced)
      http://www.ccwatershed.org/Campion/

      Inexpensive Mantillas are available
      http://www.ewtnreligiouscatalogue.com/shop.axd/Search?keywords=mantilla&x=0&y=0

      • Your Fellow Catholic says:

        For those of you who are unclear about why the Church promulgated and prefers the Ordinary Form of the Mass, please read the first document to come out of the Second Vatican Ecumenical Council, which is binding on the faithful. In particular. It is simple to read and quite majestic. Quoting a passage detracts from its power, but might be helpful to review the motivations of all the Bishops gathered and agreed from all around the world:

        “21. In order that the Christian people may more certainly derive an abundance of graces from the sacred liturgy, holy Mother Church desires to undertake with great care a general restoration of the liturgy itself. For the liturgy is made up of immutable elements divinely instituted, and of elements subject to change. These not only may but ought to be changed with the passage of time if they have suffered from the intrusion of anything out of harmony with the inner nature of the liturgy or have become unsuited to it.

        In this restoration, both texts and rites should be drawn up so that they express more clearly the holy things which they signify; the Christian people, so far as possible, should be enabled to understand them with ease and to take part in them fully, actively, and as befits a community.”

        http://www.vatican.va/archive/hist_councils/ii_vatican_council/documents/vat-ii_const_19631204_sacrosanctum-concilium_en.html

        • YFC, you just want to cause problems with your own deceitful interpretation what the Church does and does not want. The devil twists the truth too.
          And Stop trying to tell faithful Catholics what the Church teaches and what they can and can not do.
          You are so steeped in the promotion of sodomy, that you blacken everything you print.

          Quote the entire book on Liturgy from V II – because you only quoted the introduction, not the important NORMS (rules).
          NORMS:
          A) 23. Must be no innovations unless the good of the Church requires them;
          36 #1 Particular law remaining in force, the use of the Latin language is to be preserved in the Latin Rites – with only a few things being in the vernacular.
          Etc., etc., etc.

          The Ordinary Form of the Mass will probably change many more times over the course of the next 50 years as experimental, because people are leaving the Church in droves from the OF Mass;
          as they have over the last 50 years since V II.
          Those instrumental in promoting these changes in the USA were the likes of Cardinals Bernardin, Law, Weakland, Mahony, etc. (And we don’t need to discuss their characters relating to their support for child abuse in this post.) They took away altar rails so people could not kneel when receiving their God; they got a special indult for altar girls so girls would want to become Priests; they refused to give Holy Communion to those who knelt down, but had no problem giving Holy Communion to those supporting abortion.

          This is TRUTH –
          Both forms of the Mass are Holy. There is no PREFERENCE for either Mass.

          Apostolic Letter “SUMMORUM PONTIFICUM”
          http://www.vatican.va/holy_father/benedict_xvi/motu_proprio/documents/hf_ben-xvi_motu-proprio_20070707_summorum-pontificum_en.html

          • You can’t handle the TRUTH, Jose, because it might require you to rethink what the Church is teaching us in Vatican II.

          • Lee Arthur says:

            Absolutely fantastic post Jose – you’re right on. Pope Paul VI himself emphasized that Vat II was a pastoral, rather than doctrinal council, which announced as new nothing that was binding on the faithful. And following in Vat II’s wake has been an endless stream of novelty and innovation that misrepresent the faith. (The most obvious concoction is the priest facing the people, which Vat II made no mention of whatsoever!) Some of the Vat II zealots are just intent on pushing for even more innovation – like arguing the Church should legitimize the unnatural perversions which have enveloped them. That will never happen of course, and they will just die in mortal sin.

          • St. Christopher says:

            “JOSE”: Outstanding. Most Liberal Catholics, including almost many, many bishops and cardinals, see the “New Catholic Church” as beginning at Vatican II. And, in this respect, Vatican II and its implementation, represent a true revolution: in this Benedict XVI was in error (as it is assumed he secretly knew).

            “Your Fellow Catholic” and a number that post here, are “all in” on the notion of a “New Church”. And, why is that? Because of the hope that the Church will now change basic doctrine to permit homosexual relationships, adultery, fornication, and other forms of wrongful sexual expression.

            You can see the expressions of sympathy for these moral outliers in the Synod on the Family and the now famous draft Relatio and how Francis is busy riding the Church of conservative, true Catholic voices, like Cardinal Burke, in favor of listening to apostates like Abp. Forte, Cardinal Wuerl (who, incredibly, is very open to redefining doctrine under some dopey notions of changing the “discipline” as to how the doctrine is pastorally applied).

            They Church increasingly thinks of its followers as stupid, and unworthy of learning the True Gospel, and it centuries long implementation by the Church. As the Church collapses, you see the Liberal Zombie priests and spokesmen who are now shouting: “We need more, more Vatican II implementation, women priests, welcoming of homosexual gifts” and all of that.

            Stay strong. Your words, and outrage, are wonderful to read. Tell your local pastor and bishop how you feel.

          • Your Fellow Catholic says:

            Lee, if you are concerned with the priest facing the people, you would do well to study the architecture of many European churches dating long before Vatican II. There are actually a lot of basilicas in which the priest always faced the people. No need therefore, to mention it in VII. (I recall that somehwhere, I actually thought it was in VII, there is mention of the altar and the preference that it be square and probably that the priest face the people as the presider at Mass. If I find it, I’ll send on that quote).

            Jose, if you read my post, I ENCOURAGED folks to read all the Constituion on the Liturgy, and said MYSELF that quoting it doesn’t do it justice. So don’t go around haranguing me, please, for not quoting the parts you prefer. If you or anyone else followed my post accurately, you would go and read the document and I gave a link so that people would do just that.

            Yes, people in the United States are leaving the pews in droves. In some other countries, Churches are being built quite rapidly. Worldwide mass attendance is actually not all that changed from decades before VII. Besides, making a correlation between American church attendance declines, and the use of the new English language mass, is hardly proof of anything. As I have pointed out before, it is very hard to imagine American women encouraging their husbands and children to go to Mass for two very important reasons: First, American women have discovered the joys of careers outside the home. They have entered professional workplaces that used to be closed to them. They want to instill in their families that women can do anything. Then they come to Church, in which women are relegated to few if any leadership roles. Secondly, the Church has not, even now, sufficiently addressed the child sex abuse scandal, and parent wants to put their children in a place that risks such abuse. Decades of hypocrisy by Church leadership on this scandal has worn thin the patience of anyone who cares about the welfare of children.

            Finally, St. Christopher, Archbishops Forte and Wuerl are not apostates. They are bishops in good standing INSIDE the Roman Catholic Church.

        • Kenneth M. Fisher says:

          YFC “Your False Catholic”, you know darn well that, per Pope Benedict XVI, nothing that came from a Pastoral Council is binding on the Faithful. Why do you continue to spread that lie? Do you actually think you know more than Pope Benedict XVI.

          Answer one question: before the modernist seized the Church, we were taught that Protestant ministers were in fact heretics, so why were SIX heretics brought in to redesign (that is a good description of what happened) our Most Sacred Rite, the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass? I have asked that question of many, including priests and bishops, and I have never gotten an answer, let alone a satisfactory one!
          May God have mercy on an amoral Amerika and His Church!
          Viva Cristo Rey!
          Yours in Their Hearts,
          Kenneth M. Fisher

          • Your Fellow Catholic says:

            Mr. Fisher, you are incorrect. There is no difference between a “Pastoral Council” and any other ecumenical council. I have no idea why you think Benedict ever said that the Council is not binding on the faithful. In fact, talks with Archbishop Fellay broke down in part because SSPX was apparently not yet willing to accept VII.

            I also think you have some bizarre notions about Protestant influence on the mass. This allegations gets tossed all around, without a whole lot of historical bases. But even if it is true, it makes no difference. The Council, in the Constitution on the Liturgy ordered that the Mass and other rites of the Church be simplified so that overly repetitious elements and distracting parts that were added over time be removed, and that the most ancient of practices, especially from the Western Church, be restored. It wanted a Mass in which the substance of what is taking place be more clearly in evidence by the faithful, and wanted a return to greater participation by the faithful. The result – the Mass of Paul VI is very much like a sixth century mass in the Western Church. Most of what was removed were additions made in France quite late in the game. The ancient Roman Rite mass has historically been rather low key compared to its Eastern sister Churches. Did Protestant scholars help rediscover ancient texts and formulas? Maybe. Does it matter? Absolutely not, because it was the Pope who personally authorized the Mass, and he had every right and authority to do so. Doesn’t matter if 5,000 protestants carried copies of the new rite of mass to Rome on their backs. Paul VI legitimately ordered the new order of mass to be celebrated throughout the world that celebrates the Latin Rite, except in some very limited circumstances mostly in private.

          • Ann Malley says:

            YFC, even Cardinal Kasper has said that the VII documents have passages that are able to be interpreted myriad ways. That’s a problem when documents such as these are used to define Church teaching. Bishop Athanasius Schneider also has said the VII documents need particular clarification.

            But you do not want clarification, I know.

          • The Mass was not redesigned by 6 Protestant ministers. The Vatican declared that little bit of gossip false way back in the ’60s.
            I don’t want to insult you but as an act of charity I feel the need to tell you-that question will make people think you are a crack-pot. That may be why the priests can’t answer you. You might be scaring them.

          • Your Fellow Catholic says:

            Dear Ann Malley, Your quotation “even Cardinal Kasper has said that the VII documents have passages that are able to be interpreted myriad ways. ” does not give you liberty to deny the validity of the Second Vatican Council as an ecumenical council binding on all the faithful. Keep trying to obscure the TRUTH (using the capitals that your firiends here on CCD like to use), that dissing – to use a more modern phrase – of the Council, as you and others so often do, is itself an indication of your willingness to enter into heresy and create schisms in the Church. If you keep trying to deny the faith as reflected in Ecumenical Councils, as Archisbhishop Lefebvre did, you will die as he did: an apostate and a heretic.

          • Ann Malley says:

            YFC, you should not lecture about rejecting authority as you cannot even cleave to the natural law, let alone the laws of the Church.

            And if as you state Archbishop Lefebvre was an ‘apostate’ or a ‘heretic’ (quite a joke) why was there official representation from the Vatican at his funeral?

          • Ann Malley, your response to YFC reminds me of St. Therese’s little way…if we can’t be true in the small things we certainly won’t be in the big things (not that supporting same-sex relationships is a small thing)
            It makes me sad that YFC, who seems to be a very caring person, has to take this combative stance when we should all be on the same page here. It’s his achilles heel and it’s tripping him up.

          • Catherine says:

            “It makes me sad that YFC who seems to be a very caring person, has to take this combative stance when we should all be on the same page here.”

            # 1 When a person demonstrates such a “combative stance” against God’s Revealed Truth it is dangerous to think that they could care for the welfare of someone else’s soul unless they repent. Calling persecutors of Christ Church on earth “very caring” while they are the process of habitually persecuting the Church is troublesome. Especially when they are as bright as you are Dana.

            # 2 When a person goes out of their way to support illegal immigration and then posts that they want a Christian homeschooling family to be sent back to Germany so that their children can be removed from them because of their Christian beliefs, that is a hurtful insult to all Christians to have a Catholic label that behavior as seemingly being “very caring”.

          • Ann Malley says:

            Little things mean a lot, Dana, as the song goes. For it is often the aspects of our own personal lives that really tell whether we love or who we love or whether we truly love at all.

            The fiddle playing attempted by YFC at every turn is was saddens me the most for, if put to the right use, he could be such a beacon.

      • I have a Mantilla which belonged to my great grandmother which I wear to church on special occasions. I don’t know if it was expensive or inexpensive but it is a link to my ancestors and our family’s faith.

        • What a beautiful family tradition, C&H.
          I wear my mantilla to both OF and EF Masses.

          • Kenneth M. Fisher says:

            Dottie,

            When you wear your Mantilla, as long as you are otherwise modestly dressed, you are very pleasing to Our Blessed Mother. and men are pleasing to Her when they remove their head coverings in respect for Her Son, Our Lord!

            May God have mercy on an amoral Amerika and His Church!
            Viva Cristo Rey!
            Yours in Their Hearts,
            Kenneth M. Fisher,

        • Abeca Christian says:

          Dottie and C&H I have several that we bought from Mexico. They are very beautiful, well made and I’m sure, if sold here in the USA, would be expensive.

    • Ann Malley says:

      Good to have another ‘Malley’ on board promoting the TLM!

    • And for us on the peninsula, the 4th Sunday of the month at St. Catherine’s of Siena in Burlingame, I believe it’s at 5:30.

    • Linda Maria says:

      I will add one thing, to Malley’s post. Fr. William Young says the Tridentine Latin Mass at St. Monica’s Church on weekdays, at noon. St. Monica’s Church is located on Geary Blvd. at 23rd Ave., in San Francisco.

  6. The only Traditional Latin Mass in the Northern part of the Diocese of Monterey has the opposite problem – too many people to fit in the tiny, unheated cemetery chapel that is rented from the Diocese. Standing room only most of the time. And unfortunately there is ‘no room at the Inn’ at Sacred Heart in Hollister, the one Catholic Church in the area that stands empty every Sunday. No, wait, I forget, it isn’t actually completely empty every Sunday – it is used by the local Anglican’s for their service.

    • A link for those who may find it hard to believe that Traditional Roman Catholics, in good standing with the local Bishop, are not allowed to use a Catholic Church for their Mass, while Protestants are:
      http://staugustinehollister.org/

    • YGP, you need to contact your Pastor and then your Diocese Bishop when you need more space for Mass.
      Be sure to read the following before doing so, in case any questions come up.

      SUMMORUM PONTIFICUM
      http://www.vatican.va/holy_father/benedict_xvi/motu_proprio/documents/hf_ben-xvi_motu-proprio_20070707_summorum-pontificum_en.html

      INSTRUCTION ON THE APPLICATION OF THE APOSTOLIC LETTER
      SUMMORUM PONTIFICUM OF HIS HOLINESS BENEDICT XVI
      GIVEN MOTU PROPRIO
      http://www.vatican.va/roman_curia/pontifical_commissions/ecclsdei/documents/rc_com_ecclsdei_doc_20110430_istr-universae-ecclesiae_en.html

      • The Bishop of Monterey was the one that asked St. Benedict’s/Sacred Heart parish for use of Sacred Heart Church for the Traditional Latin Mass – he was told no.

        • Kenneth M. Fisher says:

          Are you actually stating that the Bishop of Monterey was told no by the pastor of Sacred Heart Church. Does he have any idea of Canon Law and the role of a Diocesan Bishop? Is he such wus that he allows a “pastor” to tell him NO?

          May God have mercy on an amoral Amerika and His Church!
          Viva Cristo Rey!
          Yours in Their Hearts,
          Kenneth M. Fisher, Former Secretary to Martyr Archbishop Lawrence T. Khai of Thare Non-Seng, Thailand

          • Yes, he was told no thanks by the pastor Fr. Rudy and his parish council when asked if the Latin Mass community could use Sacred Heart Church in Hollister on Sundays for Mass. Yes.
            The Bishop is a good man, he does not want to go against the wishes of the local pastors. Perhaps it is better that way, than using a church where you are not wanted. It appears the Anglicans are wanted instead.

        • YGP, someone is pulling your leg.
          Look at the land records of your locality (most are on the internet).
          You will find that legally the current Bishop of the Diocese literally OWNS (through his Office) Catholic Parish Churches.
          No one Priest can tell him “no”

          If all the other Mass times for the OF are well attended, you may get a later Mass time, but if the Bishop says “yes”, it will be “yes”.
          PROVIDED you have a Priest from this parish or FROM ELSEWHERE that is willing to say the OF Mass on a regular basis. – Priests have a choice on the Form of Mass they wish to say.

          The Diocese Bishop can remove disobedient Priests from parishes, immediately. In fact diocese Priests take a vow of obedience to the Bishop.

          In addition when given an invitation / permission from each particular Diocese Bishop – the FSSP will send a Priest to your location
          or train other willing Priests for the EF Mass.
          http://fssp.com/press/locations/

          • No one was pulling my leg, I am intimately involved in the Latin Mass in this area – it is a know fact. We and the Bishop asked for permission, it was politely refused.
            Once again I say, our Bishop is a good man and does not push a pastor and his parish council if they don’t want something. There is no Mass in Sacred Heart on Sundays at all, only a Protestant service. And, we have our own Chaplain in good standing in this Diocese. So there is no issue with timing or a priest to say the Mass.
            The issue here is simply that the parish is not willing to let us use their church, and our Bishop doesn’t want to push that. So we stay renting the small, unheated cemetery chapel outside of Salinas until we can find something bigger to rent that we can afford. Perhaps we can find a protestant church to rent 😉

          • Ann Malley says:

            God will bless your efforts, YGP, and give you increase to be sure!

  7. John Patrick says:

    It does not surprise me at all that the majority of Bishops oppose the Traditional Mass. They would rather see the church closed than see traditional faithful attend a Latin Mass.

  8. Fr. Illo, when was the last time you preached in church that homosexual acts are acts of grave depravity and are intrinsically disordered?

  9. Really?! MHR has a TLM? Will someone please confirm this?

    • Abeca Christian says:

      Yes its true, this website has had articles notifying the lay faithful.

    • Regarding the TLM at MHR – it is no longer celebrated there. Fr. Young, one of the few San Francisco priest who will say this Mass, was previously sent to live at MHR but now resides elsewhere and says daily Mass at St. Monica’s on Geary Street at 12noon. everyday but Wednesday and Sunday. for a complete list of up to date TLM locations in the SF/East Bay/ South Bay/ North Bay area go to : http://sanctatrinitasunusdeus.com
      Thanks be to God for the Traditional Latin Mass which I have only just discovered about 5 years ago. Having been raised in the 70’s and 80’s I didn’t even know that there was such a thing as the Latin Mass! I am home now and finally understand the meaning of Holy Mother Church. Deo Gratias

      • Thank you Kristin.
        Anyone who lives in the SFO area should make certain that their Diocese web site is up to date for both OF and EF Masses.
        http://www.sfarchdiocese.org/home/parishes

        An up to date site is important for Catholics visiting the area as well.

        Any PRIEST who is interested in learning the EF (TLM) Mass, can contact the FSSP (Priestly Fraternity of St. Peter)

        They train interested Priests for the EF Mass.
        http://fssptraining.org/

        • For Priests (and others) who want more information they may contact the FSSP,
          and/or order a video on the EF Mass.
          http://www.fsspdvd.com/

          Please pass this on to any Priests you know who want more information or are curious about the EF Mass.
          Thank you.

  10. If a good priest like Fr. Illo apparently is, speaks out about sin, homosex, abortion—all the evils embraced by the Left, he is marginalized and placed in a church where there are mostly grey hairs in an old inner city church or setting where there is little responsibility and a small collection plate.

    • Kenneth M. Fisher says:

      THEY tried to the same thing with St. John Vianney, the Cure of Ars, and look what he accomplished in spite of THEM!

      May God have mercy on an amoral Amerika and His Church!
      Viva Cristo Rey!
      Yours in Their Hearts,
      Kenneth M. Fisher

    • To John – The good Archbishop has kindly given a beautiful church, Star of the Sea, to Fr Illo to help him and Fr Driscoll start an Oratory for like-minded priests. He is not being marginalized in any way. You could, in Christian charity, make a small donation to assist their worthy efforts.

    • Star of the Sea Church on Geary Boulevard is not some old, decrepit inner-city parish with no people.
      It’s a beautiful, large church in a thriving neighborhood – what these new priests need to do it reach out to the community, most Chinese now, an evangelize!
      Catechize!
      Teach!
      Walk door to door – like the Mormons.
      Sitting alone in an “empty” church will not make the parish thrive as it did in the old days – the man needs to become a missionary to his huge community, most of whom have never come to know Jesus.

  11. Perhaps being absent from one’s assignment within the first several months after arrival is not the best approach to building up a local parish. The Church needs fewer jetsetting/careerist/celebrity priests and more who simply and faithfully work out their vocations.

  12. This thread is not about the differences between the TLM and the NO. This thread is about how to “fill” a church that has the TLM. In The City there must be enough people who want the TLM to fill the church every Sunday. The real question is how this pastor will build up the congregation. There has to be a vision that can only come from him. He must put together, with the help of parishioners and outside help, a well developed plan with milestones to be achieved by dates certain. There should be a staffing plan, a communications plan for adults and younger people, there should be classes and affinity groups for all ages, there must be multiple occasions for the parish to get together on a regular basis, there must be a plan to engage everyone in the life of the parish, etc.. Without a real plan, he will write a lament again next year and wonder why things haven’t changed.

  13. For those of you who are blind to the partial or complete truth, pray your rosaries daily and humbly that your eyes may be fully opened and that you see the complete truth. Jesus is the truth! Enough of this experimentation, man-centeredness, socialism, controversy and scandal led by wolves in sheeps clothing for the last 50 years is enough! Pray to Jesus and Mary that they will take you to a real Roman Catholic parish with real holy religious clergy dispensing sanctifying grace through the true 7 Holy Latin Sacraments that will help you save your soul.

  14. Abeca Christian says:

    Our Family was away over the weekend, out of town, we visited a new parish that offered the OF mass. It was so reverent and beautiful. We prayed and after Mass we asked their pastor to bless our family. Shortly after we left, as we were driving to go to our next destination, a sweet scent of roses passed by us. I smelled it first and asked my kids and hubby if they can smell the roses in the car, then my kids, each said Mom I smell it, then my husband too. We looked all over the car, there was nothing that would give off that scent, even outside, we opened the windows and no scent in the freeway. It just passed us. For months before that, we have been praying the rosary…I really feel that Virgin Mary came to give our family comfort and joy.

    • Ann Malley says:

      Mystical revelations, when genuine, are those that are usually closely held and not spoken about out of true humility. People don’t often go around saying, “I smelled the roses of Our Lady,” on a public forum. Quite the opposite for true mystical experience is truly humbling.

      • Catherine says:

        Thank you Ann Malley for beautifully polishing up my my own thoughts on the matter.

        I couldn’t get past the Dibs, I won! ….”I smelled it first.”

        The soul’s true greatness is in loving God and in humbling oneself in His presence, completely forgetting oneself and believing oneself to be nothing; because the Lord is great, but He is well-pleased only with the humble; He always opposes the proud.

        — St Faustina, Divine Mercy in my Soul

        • Abeca Christian says:

          Catherine said “I couldn’t get past the Dibs, I won! ….”I smelled it first.”

          To clarify to them in charity and dissolve any misunderstanding that these two ladies are trying to distort: Goes to show you how even our Pope gets slandered by “I won” accusations. Let this be a lesson to us all, how gossip and slander begin when people add malice interpretations of their own.

          Its not dibs, its not how you interpret my person in what I posted, forgive me for my lack of writing or expression, but I wanted to convey how it first began, I did smell the sweet rose scent first, it was very beautiful, I looked all over wondering where it was coming from, they did not smell it first as if it was passing by each one of us. It began on my side of the car, where I was seated, is that better? Catherine You judge me of pride but isn;t your comments representative of what you accuse me of? My sincere heartfelt sharing of this is sincere….I guess its in the eye of the beholder.

        • Ann Malley says:

          It would have been interesting if the children and ‘hubby’ actually smelled whatever it was without being asked. But again, logic and common sense when it comes to perceiving is lost on some folks.

          Much like it is completely lost on some that Christ’s presence in either rite of the mass is not the point. It is that which surrounds His presence.

          God bless you, Catherine!

          • Anonymous says:

            Envy is a deadly sin.

          • Catherine says:

            “It is that which surrounds His Presence”

            Ann Malley,

            You have never name called or insulted anyone for attending the NO Mass. I completely understand what you are charitably trying to express and convey. “It is that which surrounds His Presence.” That is so true Ann especially if even both Masses are surrounded by a bishop who shows blatant disregard for Church Teaching as to send out a memo to all priests in his diocese supporting homosexual domestic partnership. When Bishop Tod D. Brown stopped the TLM at a parish in Orange County Ca. it was precisely for the reasons that you are trying to convey but only time will prove this truth. You have never once said that the NO is not valid or that Jesus is not present. There have been corrupt tactics that are often employed to make the TLM a hardship for many to attend by deliberately removing it from a parish or locating it far away. After Summorum Pontificum Bishop Brown could no longer use the false excuse that the permission that had been granted by the previous bishop to allow the TLM at a certain parish had suddenly ended when pastor of this parish died. Yes, that is what was said when Bishop Brown deliberately scattered the flock. So when Bishop Tod D. Brown sent a memo to all priests supporting homosexual domestic partnership it was at the very same time he was removing reverent practices from even the NO Mass. There is a definite connection in this slow dismantling of Church teaching and Traditions and it is easier to achieve in the NO Mass because that was the designed intention.

            continued…

          • Catherine says:

            continued from December 3, 2014

            Bishop Brown’s Director of Evangelization for the Diocese of Orange was openly living with his boyfriend. Bishop Brown had the relatives of this priest sign a secret oath that would hide this evil. Bishop Brown even sent a young priest to have this wicked oath signed and guess what Ann, surprise surprise! This young priest who was given this evil bullying task was then made a Monsignor for carrying out this scandal and he knows who he is. No oath that hides evil is valid yet this truly happened. This was at the same time that Bishop Brown was now having churches in our diocese with new construction place the Tabernacle in a broom closet. How does one convey that this apostasy and disobedience ties in with the removal of altar rails, certain prayers at Mass and kneeling down after the Agnus Dei and the noticeable YouTube video aversion to giving Holy Communion on the tongue while kneeling. These repulsions against Tradition all tie in with the watering down apostasy of “I will not serve.” When a bishop asks his priests to serve the homosexual agenda before obediently serving God then this is an affront to the martyrs who shed their blood for Christ. Yes, Jesus is still truly present at the NO but the TLM has remained the same.
            continued…..

          • Catherine says:

            continued from 2:29 Dec. 3, 2014

            Ann Malley.

            There are also many people who attend the NO who are becoming very aware of this undermining of the Catholic Faith. Those who are in promotion lockstep with undermining Church teaching (from within I might add) will deny this. So Ann Malley when you say ” It is that which surrounds His Presence your are absolutely right. The TLM will still be suppressed and not because of a shortage of priests or a lack of people who are interested. There are priests who would come in at a moments notice from different Traditional orders to assist. It is the Full Truths (Teachings and all) that surround the TLM that will have the TLM attacked the most. A satanic worshipper may sacrilegiously retrieve a consecrated host from the NO Mass or the TLM and both of these hosts are the BODY, BLOOD, SOUL AND DIVINITY of Jesus Christ but when the blasphemous Black Mass ritual takes place it is the Latin Mass that is chanted, imitated and mirrored. That alone speaks volumes. The father of lies also sees the entire history of the FULL BEAUTY and obedience that surrounds Our Lord in the TLM. Satanic worshippers are not singing Kumbaya, On Eagles’s Wings or Protestant Hymn’s at a Black Mass even though the words of those hymn’s may seem beautiful and the reason being the surroundings of the TLM Mass contains all of the rich sounds and merits and ancient history that is attached to the Martyrs and the Saints.

            continued…

          • Catherine says:

            Continued from Dec. 3, 2014 at 2:57pm

            The father of lies seeks to defile this entire history of beauty that has surrounded thisTradition for centuries. St. Gregory the Great said. “It is better for scandals to arise than for the Truth to be suppressed.” Any bishop who is instructing his priests to support things that are evil and contrary to Church teaching and promoting a marching order army of like minded purveyors of homo-heresy is an enemy of God’s Church on earth and the laity has the duty to speak out. Ann a friend just sent me this article below last night and it ties in with this post.

            Taken from Crisis Magazine

            Popularity of Latin Liturgy is Not “Unfortunate”

            by SUSANNA SPENCER DECEMBER 2, 2014

            http://www.crisismagazine.com/2014/popularity-latin-liturgy-unfortunate?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+CrisisMagazine+%28Crisis+Magazine%29

          • Ann Malley says:

            Indeed, envy is a deadly sin. That is why promoting oneself or one’s own perceived ‘holiness’ by way of intimating mystic visitations is not a good thing.

          • Abeca Christian says:

            Ann Malley no one is promoting oneself. It is your own perception and words. FYI: I have been posting here longer than you have. So its not uncommon to share. We have seen different styles of expression that lead to love of church here and no one has crossed the line of disrespect as you have here. Even those with personal agenda’s haven’t crossed that line. We even have had very faithful traditional persons share with us their personal experiences and no one who loves our faith has ever mistreated them by posting such things about their comments here on such things as you have.

            Just wanted to inform you since you haven;t been here as long as I have. I have no power on how you will react. But I won’t hold it against you. God love you more. I’m sure those who love the Lord, will be just and not be swayed by your perceptions. If they are, I won’t lose sleep over it.

          • Ann Malley says:

            God bless you, Abeca, but you are at it again believing that ‘you’ can read hearts. You need to read posts instead, beginning with your own. And the instigating hostilities you yourself began when attempting to chasten my so-called schism. (You really should read up on the issue and from a variety of sources. Otherwise, deferring to the benefit of the doubt is a good call …or perhaps just the safer call.)

            There is no competition of time posting, Abeca. Please, stop making this personal and understand that I do not agree with your position about ignoring the ills in the Church. I choose to oppose them. That is how I answer God’s call to live the Faith. I also try to be consistent. And I trust in God completely in the attempt to do so.

            As I’ve said before, if you are nourished where you are – great. Give thanks for it. I do. But there are reasons for why the Church is in crisis and has experienced emptying of pews etc. And while you may believe that constant change is the way to ‘reach the people’ I don’t. It’s really that simple. Nothing ‘in your face’ as you seem to believe.

            God love you more, too, because comments such as, ” I’m sure those who love the Lord, will be just and not be swayed by your perceptions. If they are, I won’t lose sleep over it.” are completely counterproductive to helping anything.

          • Ann Malley says:

            Thanks for the diligent posts, Catherine, and for staying on top of reality. Useful idiots are in abundance and we need savvy folks that know God, love God, and serve God. So while others attempt to shame and silence and confuse by supporting false shepherds and the ideology that goes along with them, keep up the good fight.

            It’s worth it.

            Butt you know that. And eventually with continued effort by the grace of God the tide will turn.

          • Thank you Ann Malley! There are those who are trembling with fear at the thought of a reconciliation with the SSPX. Oh they will deny it but the way you have been attacked and so uncharitably treated is a compliment to God who gave you all of your gifts plus the desire to seek out this website. The wolves are viciously attacking one of His lambs who came to the CCD pasture for dialogue. Even an alter Christus first chose to insult instead of remembering that the priesthood is ministerial. ..“The sacrament of Holy Orders communicates a “sacred power” which is none other than that of Christ. The exercise of this authority must therefore be measured against the model of Christ, who by love made himself the least and the servant of all.29 “The Lord said clearly that concern for his flock was proof of love for him.”30 (876, 1538, 608) CCC

            Ann I could understand if people charitably dialogued with you to show you that the faith was still being fought for under the banner of being in full communion. They were even given the opportunity to simply show their unity by acknowledging there is a crisis and we should be “One” as Christ intended. God bless faithful St. Christopher and Tracy for acknowledging your beautiful gifts and Tracy who said, “Ann we need you and your gifts.” without calling you names.

            continued……….

          • Catherine says:

            continued from Dec. 12 at 12:50

            Ann Malley,

            Kind words are an invitation show the listener that you are acknowledging that there IS a crisis. We know that in the end Mary’s Immaculate Heart Will Triumph but that does not mean that we should not engage along in the battle with St. Michael the Archangel to rebuke the wolves instead of attacking the gathering lambs who love Christ. Picture the well recognized statue of St. Michael the Archangel and where is he aiming his mighty sword. St. Michael the Archangel is not directing that sword to one of Christ’s own lambs. He is directing it toward the author of diabolical confusion.

            One can’t help but notice all of the support and love given to those who have the objective disorder that was responsible emptying our seminaries of Good Men, undermining Church teaching and for 81% of children being raped and molested. Now take that objective disorder and add Saul Alinsky along with the homosexual agenda while claiming to be a “fellow Catholic” under the banner of being in full communion. Watch the enabling of the wolf that seeks to devour the sheep. You cannot tap dance with the devil. To enable someone while they are currently destroying the faith by calling them like minded is a direct insult to God. True story… Recently in France the sheep farmers all protested because the powers that be are guarding and protecting and enabling the wolves that have been devouring all of their sheep.

        • Catherine, you obviously have a grudge against this simple soul loved by God and the Blessed Mother. You could have had this same kind of favor if you had humbled yourself and obeyed the Lord. It is necessary to submit to the will of God and not pursue your own will. People who attack God’s chosen and His Church and support those in mortal sin will not experience these kinds of graces. Repent and believe the Gospel.

          • Ann Malley says:

            Mous, a truly simple soul does not go about touting their simplicity. That is much the same as one saying look at me for I am so humble. The action negates the statement. If you cannot understand that, which it seems you cannot, that is okay.

            Your understanding of ‘these kinds of graces’ is also misguided as, despite what you may believe, the mystical path is riddled with that which can be easily imitated by the Evil One and often is in order to misguide faithful who then become encouraged to believe falsely that ‘they’ are somehow more humble, holy, sanctified, etc. That is why true mystical experience is most often hidden and only revealed out of obedience to a superior. That is also why the Church in Her wisdom is slow to lend official approval of such phenomenon.

          • Abeca Christian says:

            Anonymous no one is touting simplicity. (those are her own words, whatever that is suppose to mean?) Those are Ann’s own words, her own interpretation.
            1. I never said mystical anything, she used the word mystical when she reacted to my post. I never claimed that.
            2. I never said “I won” or intention of dibs…those are Catherine’s own words.
            3. No one bragged saying “look at me I am so humble” Those are Ann’s own words. All their own words. Their malice. They continue to sin when they continue this type of behavior.

            Its not a sin to disbelieve that we experienced such things but their sin is in their slander and twisting of my post and my person. God help them more and
            God bless them more.

            Well I’m not going to waste more time discussing this with these ladies. Its not productive nor beneficial. Happy Advent Season everyone. Pray the rosary, read the CCC and scriptures. Detach your selves from these foolish arguments.

          • Ann Malley says:

            Abeca, go determine your own sins and what your posts imply. A happy Advent is one of interior reflection.

          • Your Fellow Catholic says:

            I really don’t get why you are all pouncing on Abeca Christian. Apparently you all feel threatened by a person sharing their faith experience. How sad that on a Catholic website, a simple sharing of an experience of prayer and prayer’s response should be met with such utter hostility.

          • Anonymous says:

            I just can’t express how distressed I am that a good person like Abeca Christian is treated so rudely, disrespectfully and derisively by our resident “Mean Girls” and only a few (?) anonymous posters have the guts to stand up for her.

          • Ann Malley says:

            Yes, your distress is duly noted, mous. Yours too, YFC.

            That said, your guts are rather brave when it comes to protecting and promoting that which is truly mean, the ruination of souls. This ongoing obsession with popularity contests, the popularity of the Pope, and others, is also telling as it is based on human respect, but not a love of the actual Faith.

      • Abeca Christian says:

        Think what you will Ann…but its true what we experienced. I don’t care how you reason about it because you are in grave error and you are free to not believe it. But I can’t explain it and no I am not going around as you suggest. It may not inspire you and you may accuse me of pride but I know that you enjoy adding malice to my comments, it sure says a lot about your negative nature. Not surprisingly so. I would say such comments like yours come off as spiritual envy.

        You often use the power of suggestion, to try to interpret, you throw it out there to persuade or discredit, as IF you read hearts through posts, but I tell you, that you are in grave error.

        • Ann Malley says:

          Abeca, I read your posts. There is no need to read hearts. The spiritual pride is very apparent. As your scenting roses, you may well have. But those who do experience the mystical, if you’ve read much on the subject, are most often riddled with humility at their unworthiness and have to be told to speak about it.

          Don’t believe me if you’d like. That reality is not of my making, but that of saints, Abeca. Much like the comments I’ve made about the fruits of the TLM and the Novus Ordo are not of my making, but observable realities. That may frighten you, but there is no reason for you to perpetuate the myth that you are persecuted. Or to imply that homosexuals who are ‘honest’ shouldn’t be picked on for being honest. Because, friend, that is precisely what YOU do with those who are honest in their observations when comparing the TLM and the NO.

          So tell me all you’d like that I am in grave error. YFC and his ilk have certainly shifted the tone of this thread and manipulated you like a fiddle. That doesn’t take a mind reader either.. But it is your pride that you are wrestling, Abeca, because I do not switch modes like YFC when offering you sweet sentiments of ‘glad you’re back’ etc after you just slammed him for promoting sodomy marriage. Read your own posts, Abeca, and start reading what you’re actually promoting – vacillation.

          • Your Fellow Catholic says:

            Ahh so you, Ann Malley, are slamming Abeca because she shared a kind word with me, a lowly homosexual. So if someone says the slightest kind word towards a gay person, you take them out personally, and then you destroy their spiritual experiences. Is that how it works?

          • Ann Malley says:

            I’m pointing out Abeca’s inconsistency, YFC. That is not slamming her nor is it slamming you. It is making a clear observation.

    • Love your enemy, Abeca, and ignore her.

      • Abeca Christian says:

        They are not my enemies anonymous. They just don’t like the way I write or express my self, not perfect in their eyes. They misunderstand, only the good Lord knows. Must be some bad will of their own that they need to work on. Don’t we all. Lets pray the rosary for these intentions. Its in His hands, He will correct this bad behavior. I trust IN Him alone. They are entitled to their opinion or judgements. It doesn’t make them right all the time though, I have that peace about it. Praise God for the sacrament of confession, the confessional is available to all and I know that even they visit.

        I am not a writer, I may not have written it well because I myself can’t explain it. The rose scent was strong, it was sweet and beautiful, it was as if it was passing by. Only my family will hold this close in our hearts. No one needs to believe it but what I was trying to say is that even when we are facing much troubles, that praying the rosary daily, helps and our lady is our greatest consolation. May God forgive me for not keeping it a secret. But He knows the why and its not how these ladies are spelling it to be. God love them more.

        The pastor at that OF parish we attended had an angelic smile, when he gave us a blessing. I’m grateful for his genuine love of Christ.

        • Anonymous says:

          You did nothing wrong by your witness of smelling roses. Those devoted to our Lady are always glad to hear of things like this. You are favored. You are faithful. You are loved. God has blessed you and your family. You have led your family to true faith. May God increase you. I hope your health is well.
          Are you doing the Christmas Novena? “Hail and Blessed be the hour and moment in which the Son of God was born of the Most Pure Virgin Mary at midnight in Bethlehem in piercing cold. In that hour, vouchsafe, O my God, to hear my prayer and grant my desire through the merits of Jesus Christ and of His Blessed Mother” 15 times a day beginning on the feast of St. Andrew Nov 30 until Christmas.
          Peace and love to you and your family.

        • Ann Malley says:

          “…They just don’t like the way I write or express my self, not perfect in their eyes.”

          I just cannot stand the way you shift back and forth, Abeca. It doesn’t take a writer to stick to one’s position and be consistent. Let your yes mean yes and your no mean no. If you want to protect those who are ‘honest’ in their positions then why are you so afraid to support TLM adherents?

          Look to your own bad will and or misguided good will, friend.

    • Your Fellow Catholic says:

      Dear Abeca Christian, when I first read your post, I thought to myself, “ok that is nice, sweet, but doesn’t apply to me”. But when I saw others utterly attack you for your simple witness, it made me think “wow, maybe I need to pay more attention to this”. In reality, the vast majority of us are anonymous on this site, even if we use nomes like Abeca Christian or Your Fellow Catholic. The charges against you do not take into account the anonymity that our several made up names provide. So, Abeca Christian, thank you again for sharing your witness. Whether I follow it or not is yet to be determined, but it touched me.

  15. Abeca Christian says:

    “The Church is like Noah’s ark that was full of both clean and unclean animals. It must have had an unholy smell, and yet it was carrying eight persons to salvation. The world today is tearing up the photographs of a good society, a good family, a happy, individual personal life. But the Church is keeping the negatives. And when the moment comes when the world wants a reprint, we will have them. BY”Fulton Sheen

  16. Abeca Christian says:

    “There are not more than 100 people in the world who truly hate the Catholic Church, but there are millions who hate what they perceive to be the Catholic Church. ….As a matter of fact, if we Catholics believed all of the untruths and lies which were said against the Church, we probably would hate the Church a thousand times more than they do.” by Fulton Sheen

  17. Ladies, do we need to have these cat fights on this site. The issue is about how to fill a church that offers the TLM? What five suggestions would you offer this Priest that would be helpful? If you were he, what would you do to fill the church? Wouldn’t it be nice if we could all just get out of our ruts and take some time to smell the roses?:)

    • Ann Malley says:

      One suggestion would be to discern whether the parents of the children in the thriving school are attending weekly mass. If not, why not. Sending invitations to those members who used to be on the parish register might be another means of reaching out. Or perhaps having the Legion of Mary or even the pastor take the time to visit those who used to belong to the Church. Also, the Church can reach out to retirement homes and find out if there are any shut ins who would like to attend the TLM and offer to arrange to take them to mass.

      This often leads the older folks to weep as they often feel, and rightfully so, FORGOTTEN. Much like the traditions of the Church.

      Thanks for asking, Bob One!

    • Abeca Christian says:

      Bob one its sad that one would view this as cat fights? But who can blame you.

      I only see sin in action. Cats fight because that is what animals do. One would hope that Christians, who are created in the image of God, would know better. I didn’t want to turn this into this type of forum but one has no control over other sinners and what shameful stuff comes out of their mouths. Its shameful for our church and those of faith. I have no power over this type of behavior that often happens here.

      Bob one, perhaps this beautiful church is empty because of hardened hearts, sin and prejudges against Christ’s church. Those who bare false witness against their brothers and sisters only make things more complicated against the mission of the church.

      They definitely have their opinions to everything that is for sure. So its not a cat fight. God love them. But its not a reason to dislike them. I think anonymous nailed it, anony pointed out that they have a grudge against me….they did not like me challenging them in the past, where it was needed, so this is the outcome.

      • Catherine says:

        Abeca, The only thing that is being challenged is your pride. There’s a sudden new shift in trying to silence people that’s for sure.

        Please read your responses to the abomination that took place at St. Norbert’s Church in Orange. I am starting to wonder about that Troll Website titled YFC meets Abeca Christian. YFC can’t seem to remember his earlier posts and now you too. Interesting shift.

        Taken from CCD’s “Bishop Brown is disturbed by this”

        Some parishioners at St. Norbert’s Church in Orange describe themselves as “shocked and appalled” after a priest there allowed a Presbyterian minister to concelebrate a Mass and receive Holy Communion on Sunday, Feb. 13.

        Sources from the parish told California Catholic Daily that Fr. Agustin Escobar introduced Pastor Steve Whitney of Trinity Presbyterian Church in Sacramento at St. Norbert’s 9 a.m. Sunday Mass. The sources said Rev. Whitney concelebrated the Mass with Fr. Escobar, took Communion, and was allowed to distribute Communion to parishioners.

        Posted Tuesday, February 15, 2011 10:37 AM By Abeca Christian
        The Truth Hurts is right on! We need to be outraged and outraged with actions by writing and expressing those concerned. I especially appreciate what The Truth Hurts said we need to pick and choose our battles, so the enemy will not distract us or tire us in other areas that are not so important, As we can all see, this one is very important!

        • Anonymous says:

          Catherine, why offend God like is? It is pointless. It changes nothing. It does nothing to glorify God and only shows your lack of charity.

      • Abeca, you may want to re-read the Bible.
        Jesus had no tolerance for the money changers in the Temple.
        On several occasions Jesus called the Pharisees “hypocrites”.
        Regarding Judas Iscariot, Jesus said it would be better if he had not been born.
        Jesus was not a namby pamby cow-towing to those who wanted to remain obstinate in sin.
        Jesus spoke of Hell more than anyone else in the Bible.

        Never tolerate mortal sin.
        Always speak TRUTH.

    • Your Fellow Catholic says:

      Thank you for changing the conversation.

      FWIW, I was at a parish who before mass asked parishoners to take out their cell phones and check in on facebook at the church. Explaining that that is where the younger generation gets their information about the world and that even in filled churches, there are far to few young folks to replace those of us in the dieing out generation. Then they asked us as always to silence our phones and put them away. But the point is that we need to use modern techniques (and old ones too!) to reach out to friends and family and invite them into the family of God. Sometimes that is all it takes.

  18. Catherine,
    What makes you think that evil can produce good? When will people come to their senses and face the truth? As long as the devil is able to deceive them, and as long as they don’t want to face the truth because it is so horribly ugly to confront, then the evil will continue to grow. What people will you do when the last NO minister dies or loses whatever little faith he may have had and leaves to live the rest of his life away from God?

  19. YGP, your Bishop is wrong, and weak. He needs to be a man and take responsibility for what happens in his Parishes.
    He is the authority within your Diocese, NOT a Parish Priest or Parish Council.

    As David posted, the Bishop has the authority to tell the Pastor that there will be a EF Mass, at a time when the OF Mass is not being offered, – provided there is a Priest somewhere willing to say the Latin Mass at your Parish.

    • Anne, you are correct and not correct. I think you give the Bishop more power than he really has over a pastor. When a pastor is installed, he signs papers that give him the church and its assets in many cases. Once a Pastor, it is hard to remove him for any reason except child molestation and the demands of the parishioner. That is why so many Priest have six year contracts with the Diocese. If a pastor doesn’t have a contract he is hard to remove or tell what to do. On the other hand, each Priest has taken a vow of obedience to the Bishop. I think too many of us think of the Bishop as the BOSS. He is more the Pastor and the coordinator in reality. Most “managers” are only as effective as their “employees” let them be. Allowing a non-Catholic minister to con-celebrate Mass may, however, might be enough to get the Bishop’s processes working. I certainly would take the case to him.

  20. Ladies and Gentlemen, Please, please did not our Lord say ‘you will know them by their fruits’ and also a good tree cannot bear bad fruit nor can a bad tree bear good fruit? What are the fruits of Vatican 2? The entire V2 church which includes its leadership, its dogma recited in the CCC, the NO prayer service with its many recorded liturgical abuses, and even more evident disastrous: the loss of the Roman Catholic Faith, man-centeredness (versus Christ-centeredness) and outright openness to committing sins by tens of millions of once catholic members. So with all this rotten fruit to behold, can the tree leading it all be any good? Face the facts!

    Yet Christ said He would be with His Roman Catholic Church always, even to the end of time! How then can that be as He is keeping His promise? Easily, He and His Church are the thousands of Roman Catholic parishes following tradition around the world led by very holy Roman Catholic priests, practicing strictly the TLM, Latin rituals, and 7 Holy Sacraments. The other guys wearing the clothes and sitting in the Church’s properties, filling lofty modern positions of power are just another Protestant sect, a recent creation of man much like Luther himself had invented. Pray the rosary, as for many, Our Lady and Her rosary are our only refuge in these dark times of the Great Apostasy.

    • Anonymous says:

      Vatican II is a fruit of the Catholic Church.

    • Anonymous says:

      I think this person has confused “rite” and “ritual”. The rite has not changed. Elements of the ritual have. Some people freak out.
      Do you see the Father as an angry God that needs to be appeased?
      That is not a very accurate portrayal of Him.
      Our Lady at Medjugorje (not approved) said that the Father could get angry but He does not. He offers only love.
      The refuge is consecration to the Immaculate Heart.

      • Anonymous, if you believe that Sacred Scripture (Bible) in entirety is the speech of God as required of us by the Magisterium of the Church (CCC 81) –
        you will see that in both the Old and New Testaments – GOD is VERY CAPABLE of ANGER.
        In the New Testament JESUS physically threw the money changers out of the Temple using a whip of cords and overturned their tables Jn 2:15; Mark 11:15; Mt 21:12.
        JESUS called the Pharisees “hypocrites”.

        Old Testament – Hosea 11:9 – God speaking – “I will not execute my fierce anger….”

        JESUS said – FEW will be Saved, Many will not.
        Mt 7:13-14; and Lk 13:23-28.
        God will forgive those who repent.
        There are 16 paragraphs on “HELL” in the CCC.

  21. Anonymous says:

    Christ has remained in His Church. Real Presence of Christ in the Blessed Sacrament..

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